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Re: [EP-tech] Translations and xpages

Hi all,

Maybe I am missing something but If you were to set all the static pages
to completely use phrases, what is to stop you doing:

cd /opt/eprints3/archives/multilang_repo/cfg/lang/de/

ln -s static ../en/static

I cannot say I have tested this but I cannot think of any immediate
reason why this would not work.  If you either had static pages you had
not changed to use phrases or did not have the German phrases for a page
you would just see the English version.  I think this would be the same
as if you just copied the directory but you would not have to remember
to copy each new static page you created, which it looks like you would
need to do at the moment.

Regards

David Newman


On 03/04/2019 08:59, Dennis Müller via Eprints-tech wrote:
> Hi Alan and Christöpher,
>
> thank you both for your replies.
>
> Regarding Alan's:
> Yes, copying the same template to all lang folders (automatically) would
> be a solution, allthough the question still stands, why you would want
> several copyies of the same file instead of just one.
> I see your point about RTL langs. I've seen other software projects
> solving that with special stylesheets that are used if a locale has a
> corresponding config option for the reading direction.
>
> Regarding Christöpher's:
> I understand, some things just can't be seen ahead of time. And why
> would one make things more complicated than one thinks they need to be...
> Also, +1 on charisma for the nerdy reference. ;)
>
> Thanks for the insight!
>
> Best regards
> Dennis
>
> Am 03.04.2019 um 09:47 schrieb Christöpher🐬 Gutteridge:
>> When we considered off-the-shelf internationalisation options available
>> at the time, they very much assumed all languages were in the same
>> order. This is why we opted for the named "pin" tags in phrases that
>> could be moved around between languages.
>>
>> <pin> is actually short for lynchpin, and is a reference to
>> https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Famber-the-lost.obsidianportal.com%2Fwikis%2Fsorcery&amp;data=01%7C01%7C%7C3c689300ae6940fbcca508d6b8630439%7C4a5378f929f44d3ebe89669d03ada9d8%7C0&amp;sdata=H8wKIgg0ZSgEPPSOWYckbdLVXIvPBISIjg3%2B0gd3rn8%3D&amp;reserved=0
>>
>> On 03/04/2019 08:37, Alan.Stiles via Eprints-tech wrote:
>>> But you are able to use phrases within the language specific xpage file so you have the option to replace all of the hardcoded text with phrases and then just copy the same xpage file into each language directory for minimal ongoing maintenance overhead if the template changes (even write a script to copy the template to the appropriate locations?)
>>> One concern I can see it that different languages may not fit nicely within the same template (e.g. right to left languages) so you would also need a mechanism to ensure the template didn't overwrite language specific xpage templates.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk [mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Dennis Müller via Eprints-tech
>>> Sent: 03 April 2019 08:33
>>> To: Christöpher🐬 Gutteridge <totl@soton.ac.uk>; eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk
>>> Subject: Re: [EP-tech] Translations and xpages
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> thanks for the quick response.
>>>
>>> At least in the way I understand it, I very much disagree about the "significantly increased complexity". Could you please elaborate on that or correct my assumptions below?
>>>
>>> Agreed, switching from the current to a different design would mean quite some work - and I am not demanding that. Anyone having a multilang instance is of course free to do it on their own and so are we. (Maybe better language handling would increase the number of multilang
>>> instances...?)
>>>
>>> However, having said that, the only "negative" effect of the suggested design would be that we'd have one more file max per static page. One could of course use one dedicated "phrases/static.xml" file, which would mean only one more file per language.
>>> Sure, for english-only repos that means doubling from one to two files, but I don't see that as overly complex. On the other hand, the suggested design reduces complexity and improves maintainability for every language added. And it seems to work fine for e.g. PKP's OJS and other projects.
>>>
>>> I see a practical problem in having several places where xpages can be placed (under "cfg/lang/xy/static" and under "cfg/static"). That might make things confusing. But other than that I don't see much of a problem. Can you help me understand your concerns?
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Dennis
>>>
>>> Am 03.04.2019 um 00:01 schrieb Christöpher🐬 Gutteridge:
>>>> Yes. I made that decision and nobody appears to have undone it.
>>>>
>>>> The design you suggest would make your life easier at a significantly
>>>> increased complexity for the one-language repositories which are the
>>>> bulk of instances of EPrints.
>>>>
>>>> It's not perfect, but I think it was the right trade off.
>>>>
>>>> On 02/04/2019 12:26, Dennis Müller via Eprints-tech wrote:
>>>>> Hi everyone,
>>>>>
>>>>> is there a sepcific reason why every language gets to have its own
>>>>> xpage files with hardcoded text instead of having one central file
>>>>> containing phrase references which could then be placed in the
>>>>> respective lang directory?
>>>>>
>>>>> Example:
>>>>>
>>>>> Currently we're having
>>>>> - eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/en/static/help.xpage
>>>>> - eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/de/static/help.xpage
>>>>> -
>>>>> eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/anyotherlang/static/help.xpage
>>>>> that all provide structure and translation for the help page. If we
>>>>> were to redesign the help page, we would have to change all the above
>>>>> files accordingly.
>>>>>
>>>>> So instead, couldn't we have only one file at
>>>>> eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/static/help.xpage that provides the
>>>>> structure and contains phrase refs (instead of "hard" text) that
>>>>> would be provided from
>>>>> - eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/en/phrases/help.xml
>>>>> - eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/de/phrases/help.xml
>>>>> - eprints3/archives/archivename/cfg/lang/anyotherlang/phrases/help.xml?
>>>>>
>>>>> This way, structural changes would apply to all languages at once,
>>>>> improving maintainability. The same goes for all plugins providing
>>>>> some sort of static pages.
>>>>>
>>>>> Any thoughts on this?
>>>>>
>>>>> Best regards
>>>>> Dennis
>>> --
>>> Dennis Müller
>>> Universitätsbibliothek Mannheim
>>> Digitale Bibliotheksdienste
>>>
>>> Schloss Schneckenhof West
>>> 68131 Mannheim
>>> Tel.: 0621 / 181-3023
>>> E-Mail: dennis.mueller@bib.uni-mannheim.de
>>>
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